1. - DownLeft - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 11:59 am:

   Yes, the violent video game thing is one of the oldest tricks out of the DLC playbook, along with prescription drugs for seniors. I won’t ever accuse Blago of being original.

   This is the same tactic to appear more moderate used by Hillary, Lieberman before her, Gore before him, and Paul Simon before that when he promoted the v-chip. Of course no one else besides Blago made it one of their core issues.

   I thought the Obama/Hynes Senate primary settled the question of whether Illinois voters prefer progressive Democrats or weak DLC Democrats who stand for as little as possible.




2. - Ralph - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 12:08 pm:

   Taking political advice from the Washington Times is like taking babysitting referals from the Vatican.




3. - ArchPundit - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 12:22 pm:

   But what’s wrong with the V Chip? Why shouldn’t a parent be able to block out offensive and inappropriate content and be able to personalize it depending on the kid and the family?

   This isn’t a simple issue of the DLC versus the ‘progressive wing’–it is a core swing voter issue that matters to many people who are not strong partisans, but are really uncomfortable with the messages their kids are receiving.

   Some of that is just “the kids today…” nonsense, but some of it is based on a real sense that there is a cultural problem out there and Democrats don’t address it.

   I don’t know of any progressive Democratic politicians who aren’t concerned about the cultural messages sent out with sex without consequences and violence without context. Their solutions might be different than Republicans, but talking about such problems and addressing them by giving parents more tools isn’t a bad thing.




4. - Banquo - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 12:39 pm:

   There isn’t anything wrong with the V-chip. But the point is that the parents control the V-chip. They buy a TV with one installed, they turn it on (or “set” it or whatever you do with a V-chip), and they’re responsble for what happens.

   The problems with Blago’s bizarre videogame crusade is that it’s mandated by the government. It’s something that parents should do — not farm it out to some legislative body.

   And — taking a step back — I’m surprised that people are fixated on video games as a source of “cultural influence.” Has anyone actually sat down and read, say, Grimm’s Fairy Tales or even some early Faulkner?

   You want hardcore violence — it’s there in *literature*. Forget about video games. Doom III and Quake and Half Life 2 have *nothing* — and I mean this sincerely — on Faulkner’s ‘Sanctuary.’ (Remember Temple Drake?)

   As a kid, Macbeth scared the heck out of me. Lear’s raging disturbed me. The bloodbath at the end of the ‘Odyssey’ — when Odysseus returns home — freaked me out. That’s brutal violence — and pales to anything in Doom III.

   I suggest the gov — and anyone who supports the gov’s videogame laws — take a look on their bookshelves (if they even have bookshelves.)

   Sorry, but if you want violence and worry about cultural influence, literature carries much more weight than some light blips on a CRT screen.




5. - Yellow Dog Democrat - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 12:45 pm:

   I’m a little disappointed that the Times even ran a story, because the so-called analysis in their report was nothing more than an essay around two points: Bush did better than Kerry by 20 points among married people and 27 percent of married people said moral issues were their top concern, as opposed to 20 percent of the population.

   That blip could have just as easily been about gay marriage, don’t you think?

   Show me the focus group that says parents care more about legislating video game content than they do school funding.




6. - Tom Joad - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 12:48 pm:

   The comment by Downleft that Illinois voters prefer progressive Democrats over weak DLC Democrats, using one instance of a primary victory, is naive. Our last Democratic President was a DLC Chairman. Kerry went so far to the left to appease self styled “progressive Democrats” that we lost the moderate voters, and the election. This theory that we have to continue to respond to the far left with unquestioning support has left us with a base of voters that alienates the mainstream voters the party must have to win.




7. - ArchPundit - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 12:51 pm:

   There’s a huge difference between reading and visualizing graphic violence. I agree–the Bible itself has lots of violence and sex. The key difference–and it’s similar with sex is the graphic visual nature of it and there is some evidence that both graphic types of depiction do lower the inhibitions to engage in similar behavior or at least to be less repulsed by it. Some of the research on brain chemistry suggests that such depictions change patterns related to violence as well

   Literature doesn’t have the same impact. In fact, it may well lead to an understanding of why violence is so horrific.

   The point being graphic depictions are different than literary depictions.

   To most parent’s the idea of the law isn’t to farm it out to the Lege, but to have it so they can control the decision. Take an 11 or 12 year old who has some of their own money often times, they go and buy it and hide it because parents don’t want such material in the house, the parents find it hard to control. Giving them one more tool isn’t taking it out of their hands, but giving back to them control they feel is lost.

   I have a different view of how to deal with such issues with my kids, but I can’t say I think that parents should have to worry about whether a store is selling exceptionally violent images to kids.




8. - John C. A. Bambenek - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 12:54 pm:

   So he’s being praised for not allowing kids to buy Grand Theft Auto while having parents who try to prevent their kidnapped kids from being coerced into abortions arrested.




9. - Anonymous - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 12:55 pm:

   You think kids aren’t smart enough to sidestep whatever video game “ban” is instituted?

   It’s as though Blago has no idea that the internet is out there and any kid who’s into “video games” is probably also into the “internet” — and is enterprising to realize that if he or she wants Doom III they probably wouldn’t be going to Best Buy in the first place.

   Moreover, if Best Buy is the last line of defense — lord help us all.




10. - Anonymous - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 1:04 pm:

    There is a videotape circulating around the statehouse with examples of the sex and violence in video games.

    Two things stick out:

    A gangster blowing a prostitute’s head off with much blood and gore (after it showed them having sex).

    A cartoon-looking guy having sex with a maid while another guy was masturbating in the corner.

    Anything that encourages stores to card/ID young people when purchasing these games is OK in my book. As a parent I appreciate this…




11. - DownLeft - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 1:11 pm:

    No, there’s nothing wrong with the V-Chip. The difference is that Paul Simon also had a long career of accomplishment and a habit of boldly standing up for difficult and sometimes unpopular issues.

    There’s a difference between that and Blago, who uses video game violence as a cheap gimmick to get headlines because it doesn’t take any money from the budget or require him to do much of anything at all. Its a problem when talking about video game violence becomes a substitute for dealing with real world crime and poverty.




12. - DownLeft - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 1:22 pm:

    Tom Joad,
    I could give many more examples of the failed DLC strategy such as the 2002 “let’s not challenge Bush” election strategy. The idea that Kerry spent a lot of time pandering to the left is certainly news to me.

    I was in Southern Illinois this weekend and heard a bunch of callers to a local conservative talk radio show complain about the jobs we’ve lost to free trade and all the products made in China. Those are the kind of rural voters Democrats would be getting if the corporate Democrats at the DLC had not convinced us to support free trade and sell the agenda of the party for corporate cash.

    Lieberman and the DLC crowd were wrong. Economic populist messages work. Next time Democrats might think about nominating a Presidential candidate who can pull that off.




13. - Anonymous - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 2:13 pm:

    There is a videotape circulating around the statehouse with examples of the sex and violence in video games.

    This must be like ripping out pages of a book with the “F” word and then waving them and saying, see! see! I told you books are evil!

    *shrug*

    Does no one else see the irony in circulating a videotape around the “statehouse” with these bizarre clips? Shouldn’t the legislators worry more about funding schools than sitting down in a dark room and watching some bootleg clip tape?




14. - Anonymous - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 2:49 pm:

    “…parents who try to prevent their kidnapped kids from being coerced into abortions…”

    What?




15. - Anonymous - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 2:53 pm:

    The only thing the Obama/Hynes primary settled was that Hynes was a terrible campaigner and completely ‘mussed up by Hull.

    It WAS NOT some sign that the “democratic wing of the democratic party” had won the hearts and souls of moderate Illinois voters.




16. - Tom Joad - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 4:29 pm:

    Downleft; The 2004 Presidential election wasn’t about economics, it turned on social issues. Kerry was so far to the left, the middle was won by Bush when Kerry’s social positions were pointed out to the middle class. Al Gore abandoned the DLC in 2000, and failed to campaign on the economic recovery of Bill Clinton, a DLC proponent. So, we won with a DLC member and lost twice with two left wing candidates. As for “selling our agenda for corporate cash” didn’t Kerry set a record for fund raising, and didn’t Dean set a primary record for raising cash. We need to expand the party to the center, not reinforce the small left wing of the party, which alienates the center.




17. - DownLeft - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 5:11 pm:

    TJ,On what economic issues was Kerry to the far left? He voted for NAFTA and the WTO, and only made tepid statements against them during the campaign. And you’re right to point out all the corporate money Kerry took, which is why he was never able to make a populist argument about undue corporate influence in our political system. Wanting to repeal portions of Bush’s tax cuts hardly made Kerry a left winger on economic issues. He followed the moderate DLC approach.

    The 2004 election was about fear. Bush won by exploiting fears about terror and gay marriage. You can’t beat that kind of campaign if you don’t stand up to it.

    Clinton never got a full majority of the vote for President in ‘92 or ‘96, but he did get elected in ‘92 by using economic populist themes. It works.
    I wish Gore had abandoned the DLC in 2000, but he showed his allegiance to that organization when he picked Lieberman as his running mate. Gore didn’t turn his back on the DLC until after he lost. Maybe he realized something, or maybe the DLC has changed since ‘92.

    I think you’re right about the need to engage moderate voters, but the DLC has no clue about how to do that.

    Talking about economic populist messages, like losing jobs to NAFTA, universal health care, undue corporate influence in politics, the environment, and declining wages of the average worker will win over a lot more moderate voters than talking about violent video games and asking people to vote Democratic because we’re not as bad as the Republicans.




18. - Tom Joad - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 6:48 pm:

    Downleft: You have equated left wing issues with populist issues. They are not the same. Social issues split the populist electorate along religious, conserviative, gender, race and other lines. Clinton ran and won the year after he was the head of DLC. He ran on the DLC platform he helped write. He critized Gore for not taking advantage of the economic upturn in the 90’s cduring the campaign. Remember when we had surpluses in Washington. That was Clinton following the DLC plan. You have the mistaken belief that a candidate can separate populist issues from social issues. Unless you are in a recession, it can’t be done. The two will have to addressed in a campaign. That is where moderation on some social issues makes more sense that the Jesse Jackson approach of expanding the left wing of the party as the base for all exections.




19. - Porter McNeil - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 11:37 pm:

    As the father of three young children in the Quad Cities, I cannot figure out why any parent who sees the trash on TV and in movies would be against the Governor’s video initiative.

    And, with all due respect to “down left,” how can we ignore the merits of the DLC? The DLC, which helped the Democrats and Bill Clinton craft a policy agenda that helped achieve a budget surplus, that helped reduce crime, that helped shrink welfare rolls and that helped Democrats control the White House for the nineties, that DLC should be “at the table” as we take aim at 2008.




20. - Rich Miller - Monday, Apr 25, 05 @ 11:47 pm:

    Hey, Porter. Good to have you here. Come back soon.




21. - Anonymous - Tuesday, Apr 26, 05 @ 6:44 am:

    >As the father of three young children
    >in the Quad Cities, I cannot figure
    >out why any parent who sees the trash
    >on TV and in movies would be against
    >the Governor’s video initiative.

    I completely agree. Blago is making the right call on this one.

    I hope he goes after TV next…violence, partial nudity, vulguar language, young people showing disrespect to elders, people showing disrepect to people of faith…Have you ever watched ‘The Soparnos’ or ‘Oz’? Dear God…

    It’s high time the government cleans up all this junk.




22. - Ralph - Tuesday, Apr 26, 05 @ 9:19 am:

    Porter McNeil?!? Didn’t he get five years? Is the five years up already? Man, time flies.

    That reminds me: Does anybody know what happened to Jay Fitzgerald of the Springfield State Urinal Register?




23. - DownLeft - Tuesday, Apr 26, 05 @ 11:39 am:

    Hi Porter,
    Of course you’re right that Clinton deserves full credit for his accomplishments, and it wasn’t my intention to imply that DLC members should be kicked out of the party.

    However, I don’t think what the current DLC leadership proposes is a winning electoral strategy, and I will disagree with anyone who suggests that the DLC approach is the only way to win in a state that has sent liberals like Obama, Durbin and Simon to the US Senate.

    I find myself in agreement with what Frank wrote in What’s the Matter With Kansas? about how the DLC strategy has hurt Democrats in the Midwest. But, I’m still happy to see a DLC Democrat beat a Republican.




24. - Anonymous - Tuesday, Apr 26, 05 @ 11:49 am:

    But where does an 11 or 12 year old get “money of his own”? He gets it from his parents or from gifts, but technically, unless he’s been emancipated, his parents own “his” money and can control how he spends it.

    That being said, I don’t care if stores card for video games; it won’t bother me. What disturbs me are the people wanting to change what I can watch on my own TV.




25. - Porter - Tuesday, Apr 26, 05 @ 11:32 pm:

    To downleft,

    I apppreciate your thoughtful analyses, but I just don’t think we pull the plug on a group (DLC) that helped us win the White House eight years and that helped our President (Bill Clinton) enact successful and politically popular policies like 100,000 cops on the street, deficit reduction, economic growth & smart strategies for downsizing the federal gov’t.

    And to “ralph,” yes I have been gone from Springfield for five years living in the Quad Cities, my home.

    And to Rich, keep up the great blog. I’ll be back.

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